May 12, 2004

Tell me something I don't know

I'm even more pissed off today then I was yesterday and I've got questions.
I don't know any Muslims well enough to ask them about this whole war on terror thing, so, if there are any Muslims out there who care to educate me about the everyman attitude about it, feel free. In the mean time, here's what I'm thinking today:

I see vicious barbarians murdering innocent men women and children. I see throngs of hateful sociopaths in the streets shouting for jihad against "infidels". I see suicidal "martyrs" destroying themselves just to kill as many strangers as possible and no one amongst you speaking out against it.
This is what I see because that's all you show me.

Where are the voices that want to set me straight? Tell me that Islam is not an evil religion. I really want to believe it. If these terrorists are an aberation then say so.

Where are the good Muslims who want to rescue their beautiful faith from the gangsters that have hijacked it and use it to justify tyranny and mass slaughter? All I've seen are appologists at best, and ranting would-be fellow tyrants at worst.
This is what I see because that's all you show me.

The word islam means "submission." By "Islam" do you mean your submission to Allah, or my submission to you? Is the imposition of your faith on me your mission - even if I choose not to submit? Is my brutal painful death by torture the price I have to pay for not following the same star that you do?

If that's the case then all I can conclude is that the war on terror really is a war on Islam -- just like I've heard it said so many times by so many muslims.
If you want to claim that terrorism and tyranny are not the ways and means of "defending" Islam then please do, because I haven't heard it yet.

A man walked up to Jesus and asked him what he had to do to receive the blessing of God. Jesus told him to give up his riches and follow him. The man was sad because it was too big a sacrifice for his selfish self to make.
What did Jesus do? Did he chop of his head in five easy strokes? Did he call for the mob to stone him? Did he burn him alive and string up his remains on bridge over the Jordan River?
No; Jesus let him go on his way -- hoping that one day he would change his mind. This is the difference between religious freedom and religious tyranny.

Can I walk along the streets of Saudi Arabia with that Verse in my hand? Can a Jew walk down the streets of Syria with an open Talmud in his hands?
Can a Muslim walk down the street of any free society with an open copy of the Q'aran?
Even Israel -- a "Jewish State" with the star of David on it's flag -- is not a theocracy, and all Israelis of any faith are free to express their faith openly.

Okay, so most people are content to go about their daily routine without ever speaking out against the twisted amoral choas that they see on the nightly news. No matter our religion, our time is more consumed by work and play than with activism.

But, if there's a silent majority of peace-loving, religious freedom-loving, live and let live Muslims out there, now's the time to show your presence. I want to see you -- just to know that you're there and that Islam really is a religion of peace and mercy and not a religion of anger, repression and treachery 'cause I ain't seen that yet 'cause all I can see is only what you show me.

Posted by Tuning Spork at May 12, 2004 12:56 PM

I am becoming increasingly convinced that they have shown us all there is.

Posted by: Stephen Macklin at May 12, 2004 03:11 PM

Hello there, I am Jawad and I am Laura's boyfriend. I read your comment and I would like to briefly respond to you. As a muslim, I am not very happy about all the violence that I see being committed by muslims but here's the deal. As a responsible citizen of your country, you need to be informed about the reasons behind all the troubles happening and you also need to be aware of all the crimes that are committed against our people throughout the world. Oh and don't judge a religion by what you hear about it or by what Alqaeda people do and instead take some time , pick up a copy of the qoran and read it and stop being ignorant.
By the way, your live and let live thing doesn't make sense because just like christians send missionaries throughout the world to convert people, we also have an obligation as muslims to spread our religion but peacefully though.
Your analogy about what Jesus would've done is also misplaced because as muslims, we automatically believe in religions that preceeded us, including christianity, I bet you didn't know that. So just do yourself a favor, read a little more before you pass judgements about people

Posted by: Jawad Hidane at May 12, 2004 11:28 PM

160 years ago, in the year that all of Jesus' prophecies about 'the One like unto the Sun of Man' can be seen to have come to complete fruition (Matt 24:14, Luke 21:24, Matt 24:15), that year (1844) was the year 1260 on the Hejira calendar of the Muslim world.

Islamic prophecies and traditions had long promised that the Holy One would come in the year 1260 ('time, times and half-a-time' in Biblical prophecy) and Muslims across the Islamic world were waiting for the Twin Holy Ones ('Twin Stars, Twin Candlesticks, Twin Lights' written in the Book of Revelations).

When He came, however, it was Muslim priests and ministers who obstructed Him, heaped humiliation and abuse on Him (cf. 'The Passion of the Christ') and led the people AWAY from Him.

He came down from heaven May 23, 1844 and was very shortly thereafter imprisoned, beaten bloody with the bastinado, and was hung up to be executed by Christian Armenian soldiers IN ORDER TO PROVE He was not the Forerunner of the Lord of Hosts.

750 riflemen fired at pointblank range, and failed to injure or kill Him, so their duty was done and they left, whereupon the observing crowd of 10,000 began to get restless, and called for the priests and ministers to stand in His place!

So they called in a Muslim regiment which killed Him in their first volley, that same day, July 9, 1850.

When the Lord of Hosts became known to humankind, 1853, He was with us the full 40 years promised by Micah (Micah 7:15) and His imprisonment in Akka led to the founding of the world center of His Faith there: the Faith of God, eternal in the past, eternal in the future.

When Muslims turned away from Him (Them), the Muslim world turned TOWARD priests and ministers who had little or no light in their minds, no enlightenment in their souls, hence only spiritual depravity and bankruptcy.

The results of 160 years of abusing and killing His followers, hiding the truth from the people of Islam, tyrannizing and abusing and murdering the people of the Islamic nations, is now being demonstrated for all the world to see.

The violent, vocal minority bully and hush the moderate, decent moderates, just as Christian clergy 'scoff and deny our Lord Who redeems us' could have returned at the time and in the manner He (Jesus of Nazareth) actually promised.

There's more to this wondrous story. Learn for yourself.

Eye Opener

Posted by: Eye Opener at May 13, 2004 12:58 AM

Jawad!!! Thank you thank you thank you for commenting here! I've heard so much about you and I'm thrilled to finally read your words!

"As a muslim, I am not very happy about all the violence that I see being committed by muslims..."

Lawruh (Laura) sat beside me as I posted and told me about how furious you are about these al-Qaeda maggots and what they've done. Refreshing to hear as all I get in the media is vitriol.

"...but here's the deal. As a responsible citizen of your country, you need to be informed about the reasons behind all the troubles happening and you also need to be aware of all the crimes that are committed against our people throughout the world."

Maybe so. But, I still don't know what they are.
Are you referring to the Crusades, or something else? If so, what exactly?
The Crusades was a response, by Christian European countries, to the militant jihad of Islam centuries ago.
If you want to legitimize -- or for me to "understand" the pathology of Islamofascist terrorists by pointing to the Crusades -- then you must admit to legitimizing the Crusades. If warriors of one religion are to be "understood" then warriors of all religions are to be, as well.
I know, from what you wrote, that you don't accept that view, but by asking me to "understand" the centuries-old roots of Islamic terrorists you must also ask yourself to not make excuses for current barbarism. We are here now; let's just deal with that!

"Oh and don't judge a religion by what you hear about it or by what Alqaeda people do and instead take some time, pick up a copy of the qoran and read it and stop being ignorant."

Fair point. At the same time that I ask for you to explain the news, I should require myself to take the initiative to get myself past the news.

The muslims I meet on a daily basis are some of the friendliest, hardest-working, decent and welcoming people I come in contact with (though Jamaicans may have ya beat, mheh!).
But, the lack of outrage from the muslim clerics and "leaders" is deafeningly quite.
At the same time that I know I should educate myself about the faith, I also want guys like you to voice the Truth that al-Qaeda is an abomination of a great religion... and we haven't seen that.
The streets fill with angry young men pumping their fists and calling for the savage deaths of Jews and Americans for seemingly no reason other than that they're a Jew or an American.
I don't know what legitimate beef a muslim has -- other than the obvious: a sense that free culture is a pox on holiness(?).

BTW, I'm an agnostic. I don't even believe in God or Allah or Buddha or Zeus. I do believe, however, in the Right of each and every individual to freely explore his or her own faith according to how he or she sees fit and, above all, to let others freely do the same.

"By the way, your live and let live thing doesn't make sense because just like christians send missionaries throughout the world to convert people, we also have an obligation as muslims to spread our religion but peacefully though."

Great! But, with "live and let live", I was obviously referring to the terrorist scum who blow up city buses and fly airplanes into office buildings just because they have nothing better to do but kill strangers who are better than they'll ever be and whose kindness they'll never understand.

Evangelism is fine and dandy so long as it doesn't become a threat. You're not comparing Christian missionaries -- or shaku buku Buddhists for that matter -- with mass murderers, of course.
Spreading the Word is a common practice of all (most) religions' believers. But killing "infidels" is something else altogether. I don't see the Christian missionaries slaughtering villages that refuse to convert to Christianity, but I do see Islamist fanatics garbbed in TNT tuxedos exploding themselves in marketplaces.

"Your analogy about what Jesus would've done is also misplaced because as muslims, we automatically believe in religions that preceeded us, including christianity, I bet you didn't know that."

I do know that. So explain, then, the hatred toward Israel. I've searched the web over the past few years and all I can decifer is that the Islamist muslim Middle East hates Israel because they're non-Islamists and "on their turf."
Don't the still-faithful decendents of one religion of the region have as much Right to live peacefully at home as the decendents of another?
I still want to know why walking down a street in Saudi Arabia with a Bible or Talmoud is a crime.
Evangelism and tyranny are two different things.

If you love Liberty as much you do (and I'm guessing that that's why you're a responsible citizen of your/my country) then you must admit that the governments of the Islamic world are sickeningly repressive and cruel to anyone that chooses to want to search things out for themselves.

If every citizen of the region were as enlightened, well-adjusted and introspective as you, and most others, then there'd be peace on frickin' Earth! Unfortunately, there's a significant number of religious tyrants in that part of the world that seem to be consumed with resentment that not everyone is exactly. like. them. And way more so in the Middle East than elsewhere. (There are two types of religiously repressive societies: Islamist and Communist.)
Is it the region or the religion? A bizarre happenstance or something inherent in the dogma? That's what so many of us wish to find out.

I know that you see this and that it pisses you off as much as it does me. The whole point of my post, though, is that the thing to do is not to merely chide me for not pro-actively searching enough for the answers, but, also, for the millions upon millions of people like you to get the word out that these terrorists are sick #@$&%s who need to be condemned, not "understood".
(Maybe it wasn't obvious, but that's why I stressed the whole "I only see what you show me" line. Tell us that our vision is narrow; don't just leave it for us to discover - 'cause the middle east might be just a plate of glass by then...)

"So just do yourself a favor, read a little more before you pass judgements about people."

Er... I passed no judgement in my post; I asked questions and for some input. Thank you for posting some!

(hope I didn't piss you off again... )

Posted by: Tuning Spork at May 13, 2004 12:59 AM

Eye Opener! Are you the same Eye Opener that occassionally posts at Misha's? If so, I'm honored by your presence! :D

Posted by: Tuning Spork at May 13, 2004 01:07 AM

I'm going to reflect a little on Jawads post, but I do have a few immediate thoughts. Please take this as civil exchange and not attacks, ok?

"As a muslim, I am not very happy about all the violence that I see being committed by muslims but here's the deal."

'but' Sorry friend, you should have stopped before typing that word. There is no excuse and no justification for the atrocities commited in the name of Islam.

And if you'd like to discuss root causes, then that is the root cause for the attitude of the non-Muslim world. We don't hear condemnation, we don't hear outrage or disgust or regret. All we hear is "but" and a whole lot of weak justification.

Lately, I've been saying that Islam needs to go through a modernization and reformation. It seems that the 'everyday' Muslim has allowed his religion to be co-opted by the most radical elements, who do evil in its name. The west assumes there are non-evil Muslims in the world, but for many that's an assumption (act of faith, if you will) because we never hear from them.

Until Muslims take back control of their religion and unequivocably denounce the radical elements, then Islam in general will be distrusted. If you can't or won't do that, then whether the majority agree or not doesn't matter, because for all practical purposes you're giving tacit approval to the evil done in Islam's name.

Christians do horrible things to each other, sometimes in the name of God. So does every religion including Islam, so there is no moral high ground here. We can exchange examples all day long of one side doing bad things to the other, each one true and each one wrong. That's just keeping score, and gets you nowhere except inflaming the next zealot who thinks he owes someone.

Like I said, these aren't meant to be personal attacks, nor attacks on Islam. They *are* meant to be critisism and hopefully we can discuss and debate this, because in today's world this kind of dialog is desperately needed.

Posted by: Ted at May 13, 2004 08:29 AM

The Nick Berg Video Can Be Found At and it's pretty harsh.

Posted by: henry at May 13, 2004 12:05 PM

Ted I agree. We need to engage in a dialog with people like Jawad, however in large part the are utterly silent.

Posted by: Stephen Macklin at May 13, 2004 02:25 PM


The other comments chiding you for your call for understanding are right on the money. If you think that the kuffaar around you are ignorant that's something you can attempt to address. But it is a totally different matter than the reticence of peaceful Muslims in the face of attrocities committed in the name of Islam.

Note that a large number of Americans are loudly denouncing the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American troops. The vast majority of Americans, even "right-wingers" and militia types who denounced the actions of the BATF and FBI at Waco, condemned the Oklahoma City bombing. Only a few people tried to shift the blame, arguing for understanding, but they were rightfully shunned.

When you speak out against the acts you abhor, you make clear to those around you that your moral values are superior to the pigs we see on TV cheering those acts. When the majority of Muslims, who are peaceful and decent people, speak out more, this will further establish a more positive image in the minds of Westerners.

On September 11, a Muslim acquaintance of mine was visited by a scumbag, who was obviously very happy and not doing much to conceal this fact. Thousands of people who had never harmed any Muslims died horrible deaths, but this smirking son of a bitch saw it as some sort of victory. The guy I know didn't show such feelings, but neither has he said anything about those, or subsequent, acts of terrorism. I let him know that I was worried that people might retaliate against Muslims and assured him that I wouldn't stand for such things. He said nothing about it. Though he is a nice guy, I still feel uneasy not knowing how he feels, particularly in light of the fact that he has associated with shitheads who celebrated the slaughter of innocent people.

You can only help yourself and the image of Islam in the eyes of Westerners by speaking up and not saying "but...."

Posted by: Robert at May 13, 2004 04:34 PM

Jawad, if you're back to read these comments.. hello again.

While I think I got the point of the post across, I 'm not sure that you know exactly what I'm looking for. It's not so much that I want to hear a condemnation of terrorism from you specifically, but that I want to know why you think it is that we don't hear condemnations from the Muslim world generally.

Just in case you still think I'm an ignorant blowhard speaking out of my ass, let me relate something of my own experience on the topic. I think it'll help get across just what kind of response I'm fishing for.

My family is Irish Catholic. Now, we never really talked much at all about politics and religion while I was growing up, but I was aware of the situation, in '70's, in Northern Ireland.

The only memory that I dig up right now is of a time when my mother was pouring tea at the dinner table. I said (and I was probably about 11 or 12 years old at the time) "Let's all have some tea and pretend we're British!", to which my Grandmother replied sardonically, "Not THIS Irishman..."
I wasn't really sure exactly what all the fuss was about at the time, but was going to learn.

The Irish Republican Army (IRA) was/is a terrorist organization that targetted Protestants in Ulster as well as targets in Great Britain proper.
It was a surreptitious arm of the Sinn Fein political party -- a pro-reunification party (among many other things).

While I was in High School the troubles in Ireland was a running story. (This was around the time of Bobby Sands and the other hunger strikers.) I was fiercly pro-reunification, and even wrote several angry songs about it.
I didn't endorse the IRA's use of terrorism, but didn't speak against it either.
As a matter of course, that's how it was with most Irish Catholics, and most other supporters of Ireland's desire to out the British from the island.

Throughout my college days the situation in Northern Ireland would occassionally come up in political and religious conversations. Every so often someone would comment "The IRA? There a filthy terrorist group."
Y'know what I always said to that? "Yes, they are. But..."
So, I think I can understand exactly how you were thinking and feeling as you wrote your above comments.

While nobody specifically and outrightly endorsed the IRA's tactics, it was always a guilty pleasure for many of us to feel a bit satisfied that someone -- anyone -- was taking on the British. The victims weren't victims to us; they were just ideas. The horror of the means always gave way to thoughts of the ends. A shady smile here, a fist pump there. Even by the most rational of us -- people who could never themselves step on spider much less be a terrorist -- it was just expected behavior.

A few years later, sometime during my mid-20's, I somehow realized what a bogus trick I was trying to pull. All I was doing was trying to change the subject from terrorism to reunification. From the means to the ends. Why?

Because, even though I understood that the IRA "soldiers" were murderous rat bastard baby killers, and the ends didn't justify their means, somewhere deep down inside of every sinful human heart there is a place that entertains the idea that maybe they do.
I had to wonder which I truely despised more: the awful murder a few innocents by terrorists or the British occupation of Ireland.

It was a moment of clarity. I knew that I hated the IRA's terrorism more for a few reasons.
1) It kills innocent people for nothing but the sake of a political point being made by an inhuman dirtbag (even though the dirtbag and I agreed on a certain political issue).
2) Living under British rule is not a curse. It's a much wealthier country and the benefits to the quality of life are obvious.
3) The Protestants in Ulster outnumber the Catholics by something on the order of 4-1, and the county had voted several times in the past century to remain a part of the U.K.
and I believe that borderlines matter less than the people within them.
4) I realized that my interest in the issue was always an emotional one. That I supported reunification more out of a vague romantic notion of Ireland being whole again rather the actual circumstances of the present and the county's demographics and democratic choices.
My desire for reunification was a completely selfish one -- not a rational one.

I have condemned the IRA ever since. Openly and without any "but"s...

Maybe you could expound on these points and add a few others.
For instance: Lawruh today posited the theory that Muslims are conditioned by the practice of their faith to be so humble that they find it in bad taste to drawing attention to themselves by protesting terrorism. Hmmm.

Or perhaps it has alot to do with fear of speaking out against their corrupt and brutal terror sponsoring dictators.

On that I'd say this:
Immediately after 9/11 we were all told that Islam is not to blame; that terrorism is an un-Islamic bastardization of Islam -- just as the IRA is a bastardization of Catholicism -- and most people accepted that (or tried to) because we want to believe that.

But lately it's been getting harder and harder for many non-Muslims to continue to believe it because of the silence of the majority.
In the past two days I've visited many blogs like this one (most of 'em a lot more interesting) and there's been a disturbing amount of religious bigotry going on. If you'd read what I'd read over the past two days, Jawad, the veins in your forhead would burst.
Many of them go something like this:

I just watched the Nick Berg beheading video and all I have to say is that Islam is clearly the Devil's religion... why are we dying for these maggots?... we should just pull out our troops and NUKE the whole place... so a few innocents will die, so be it... let's just turn the region into plate glass and be done with it...

You can dismiss them as just a gaggle of under-educated magpies who ought to take the time to research the truth about 99.99% of muslims throughout the world. But, why do that? Why do nothing when you can do something to keep this kind of rot from growing in volume?

When I kept repeating "I only see what you show me" I was speaking as if through the mouths of some of those bloggers I've been reading, and I'm looking for a Muslim's answer.
I can try to give an answer myself, but I can't speak it with authority -- I'm not a Muslim. But if I can coax a few like you to address it then it might go a ways toward heading off the illusion that al-Qaeida really does represent Islam just as it claims to.

So, in closing (yay!), don't trust the masses to know better. If you see someone forgetting the way to Understanding then remind him which way to go as soon as you can, because, pretty soon, he'll be too far gone and away from you for you to hope to reach him again.

Posted by: Tuning Spork at May 13, 2004 08:13 PM

3rd post for Jawad:

Okay, I just found this at another blog:

Wipe them out. All of them.

Let us bathe in muslim blood. I mean it literally.

Level a town, round up the survivors as they stumble out of the flames and rubble. Bleed them dry the same way they insist animals must be killed and save the blood for bathing in as a show to those who have not been rounded up and bled yet.

Men, women, and children. No exceptions. No mercy.

The "ordinary" muslims have had their chance to step up and say "This is not our religion and we will tolerate it no longer" to the terrorists amongst them but they have not taken that chance.

I have NEVER ONCE - NOT EVER - heard any muslim organisation condemn any attack on the West or on Israel without adding a "but"

Whether that "but" is "I can understand why they did it" or "but the Jews did it first" or even "but (the jews, americans etc) are partially to blame" it does not matter.

Those filthy pigs refuse to take sole and absolute responsibility for their actions so they can die in the same way as far as I am concerned.

We must continue this until every single muslim on this entire planet quakes in fear of us Western Devils. Until not one single muslim feels safe anywhere on this planet.

For as they took off his head, we now take off our mask of morality, mercy, and civilisation.

Failure to do so means we have lost and the next XX years before we are all physically dead by their hand are irrelevant.

Never mind who said it or where I found; but I've been reading comments by this particular blogger for a couple of years now and he's normally a very insightful and rational man.


The silence of Muslims everywhere is being seen as a kind of complicity and it's happening more and more.

It doesn't matter how much you want him to trust what he reads instead of what he sees.

When it comes to a question of when is the time for good men and women to defend their religion against the slander that is besetting it due to the atrocities of monsters: the message is that the time. is. now.

No matter how you define jihad; a defense of the faith; a personal battle against vice; a rejection of amoral Western culture.
Speak out. Condemn terrorists. Overthrow your tyrants. Live in peace.

You'd be surprised at how fast your perceived enemy will respectfully become your friend, and how your perceived friend (read: useful idiots) will suddenly look like the enemy.

I think you understand that last dig!

Posted by: Tuning Spork at May 13, 2004 08:56 PM

Hi guys again. I was so overwhelmed by the amount of postings that I received, it proves a lot of people do care about the whole issue and this also makes me very tempted to elaborate on a lot of points that you guys touched upon.
I will try to summarize what I meant by "the crimes committed against our people", oh and before I forget, this is just for the sake of informing the average uneducated American and is not meant as an excuse for anything, ok?.
The crusades, that's not even an issue for me because religious wars have happened in the past and will continue to happen in the future and people will always kill in the name of God. What I meant was:
1-the colonization and division of Arab and muslim nations( including my country Morocco)by western nations in the 19th and 20th centuries and how after they withdrew, they left us drained and weak. We didn't ask to be violated and colonized.
2-The rape and daily slaughtering of Palestinian civilians by the number one terrorist state( Israel).Palestinians have stones and their bodies as a weapon while Jews have F-16s sold to them by the United States. For anyone of you who doesn't know much about the western genocide against the Palestinnian nation, read history but beware, don't read the history books written by Jews and try to look for books that are impartial and which state the facts only
3-American policies in the whole region have always been one sided, anti-islamic and pro Jewish. When Muslims were murdered in Bosnia, Clinton didn't interfere but when Kuwait was invaded, MAN that was a different story( we call it oil my friends). America itself has supported and still supports Arab regimes that are much worse than Saddam's, an example of those regimes is my own country's brutal regime of Hassan the second. The list goes on and on and on.
4- The war agains Irak was under false pretenses as we all know, I don't have time to explain why Bush went there in the first place but don't you guys think that as an invaded nation, Irakis are entitled to defend their country, after all, they didn't start this war, did they?. In a war, I hate to say, a lot of innocent people die on both sides. While I was absolutely mortified by the beheading and the showing of the head to the camera( ask Laura, I was not happy), let's all be honest here, what was this guy doing in a war zone to begin with???.
All the points I brought up are just for the sake of clarification, but as an Arab, I am very saddened by the whole thing because it only widens the gap of misunderstanding and makes our world a very dangerous place to live in.
Muslims in general are very nice people and those that visited a muslim country will testify.
I am also very proud of my faith( although I have to admit I don't even practice it) and those that keep converting to it everyday know what I am talking about . What's at stake here is us as humans and whether we will ever tolerate one another. Today's extremists are blaming their own inadequacies and the failures of their nations on the west, the west is only partly to blame. However, Islam( as far as I know and I do know) never asks me to kill a non muslim or to behead anyone. On the contrary, it's a powerful and positive force in my life. It brings morality and purity to me. If America had that, the divorce rate wouldn't be so staggering and homosexuals wouldn't be getting married in San francisco, oh and there wouldn't be babies fathering babies. See Muslims don't have all those things because they have a great faith that regulates their lives.
For those that said they don't hear anyone condemning the recent killing, YOU GOT ONE RIGHT HERE but at the same time, I condemn killings made by Americans also, which go largely unreported in the media).
A lot of Muslims are peace loving people who care only about raising their families but those same people need to have some reassurance that they are not targeted everywhere they set foot.
Thank you all for the intelligent postings, for those very few hateful and ignorant people who posted those few comments, I say KISS MY ASS. If you hate me without knowing me, I don't care about you anyway. If you think you will come and attack me just beause of my nationality, I am ready for you( you are in for a surprise, I know how to defend myself, isn't this the country where everyone has the riht to bear arms?).
God bless you, God bless America and God bless Islam.

Posted by: Jawad Hidane at May 14, 2004 05:03 AM

Jawad, your latest post is an education for me. And even though you claim you're educating us uninformed Americans, you once again you fall back on blaming anything and everything else for the problems that Arabs and Muslims are having.

First off, you forgot to include the Persians and Turks when you blamed the west for invading and "leaving you weak". In truth, where the west took over, they did so from the Ottoman empire, which certainly didn't much respect the indigenous people.

Secondly, you reveal your bigotry with the warning about "Jew" histories. As if the only truth available is from a non-Jewish source, although I think what you meant to say was a non-western source.

You claim moral superiority because of your Islamic faith, and you're right about oe thing - if Americans were more like righteous Muslims we'd kill all those evil homosexuals and make sure that babies having babies were taken care of with a ritual honor murder. Again, there's no tolerance in your position, just an affirmation that your way is the only correct way.

American policies have been pro-Jewish, but calling them anti-Islamic is going too far.

"When Muslims were murdered in Bosnia, Clinton didn't interfere but when Kuwait was invaded, MAN that was a different story( we call it oil my friends)"

Better let the Muslims in Bosnia know that they hate us, because they overwhelmingly supported the US going after Saddam. They did that because the US protected them when the Serbs were trying to perform their 'ethnic cleansing'. The US didn't make a distinction between Muslim or any other religion, they just stopped the attempted slaughter against the Muslims by the Serbs. Sorry if that doesn't fit your version of reality, I guess the entire world except the Middle East read the wrong history.

"The war agains Irak was under false pretenses as we all know."

What false pretenses are you claiming? The years of failure by the Iraqi government to comply with the terms of their first surrender? Their failure to comply with seventeen separate UN resolutions? Once again, you're bending over backwards to ignore and twist facts to fit your prejudices.

If you're going to educate me and then claim it's about the oil, you'd better make time to back it up with sources, otherwise you just sound stupid.

"what was this guy doing in a war zone to begin with???"

From what I understand, he was trying to drum up business selling antenna's to help rebuild Iraq's infrastructure. Sounds like a businessman to me. You imply that he deserved to die for being there. What does Islam say about empathy?

I won't go into the whole Israel/Palestine situation, but I will say that anyone who seriously equates suicide-bombings of innocent civilians with the assasination of the leaders of an organization which not only admits to, but celebrates acts of terrorism, needs to learn some humanity. Yes, it's horrible when innocent Palestinians are killed by Israeli missiles, but there is a difference between that and deliberately targeting them.

Jawad, I'm not comforted by your viewpoint. In fact, it scares hell out of me.

Posted by: Ted at May 14, 2004 04:34 PM
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